Leigh (@lshfoster) and Ellie (@elliebrigida) talk about why Mona Lisa Smile Should've Been Gay. The IMDB synopsis is as follows: A free-thinking art professor teaches conservative 1950s Wellesley girls to question their traditional social roles. This movie has the highest number of characters that should've been gay out of any other movie we've done. Katherine Ann Watson (Julia Roberts) ends the movie without any man and was the catalyst for quite a few of her students' discovering their sexuality. Amanda Armstrong (Juliet Stevenson), the only out lesbian in the movie, gets far too little screen time and leaves us too soon. Giselle Levy (Maggie Gyllenhaal) is our favorite bisexual and it was impossible to pick just one person to ship her with. Betty Warren (Kirsten Dunst) is the dark horse gay of the film, serving up some gay goodness when she leaves her husband and moves to Greenwich Village with Giselle. Honorable mention to Giselle and Connie (Ginnifer Goodwin) for literally always being on top of each other or kissing each other's cheeks. Oh and did we mention Marcia GAY Harden?! Enough said. Follow along on Twitter @lezhangoutpod and Facebook and Instagram (@lezhangoutpod).
Leigh (@lshfoster) and Ellie (@elliebrigida) talk about why Incredibles 2 Should've Been Gay. Voyd is the queer fan girl in all of us when she meets Elastigirl. Violet will totally have a coming out moment in college. And the biggest lesbian of them all is Evelyn Devers, our favorite super villain. What's the gayest thing about her? Her hair is perfectly unkempt. Her outfits just scream boss lesbian. That lesbian smoulder. The fact that she can't sit. There is too much evidence to pick just one. And Elastigirl herself. Is sexuality elastic? She falls in love with being the gender roles being reversed and we don't think that's the only think she falls in love with. Follow along on Twitter @lezhangoutpod and Facebook and Instagram (@lezhangoutpod).
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Singing: Theme Song
Ellie: Welcome back to Lez Hang Out. I'm Ellie Brigida...
Leigh: And I'm Leigh Holmes Foster and here's what's happening this week.
Singing: [Music] This week in the Lezdom [/music]
Ellie: This Week in the Lezdom is somewhere we can touch base each episode about things going on with the podcast or otherwise and the first thing we have to talk about is our live show in Boston. We are so excited. It's going to be June 8th at 7:00 PM at WBR City Space. You can get tickets at bit.ly/lezbostonlive. We are so excited. We hope to see all of you there. We're going to be having Marie Connor, who's this tall, awkward girl on Twitter. If you're not following her, you should. She is hilarious. Dylan Usher, who actually opened for Fortune Feimster, which is pretty amazing and Isha Patnaik who is actually featured in the 2019's HBO Presents Women in Comedy Festival. We are so excited. We're going to be talking about why the Little Mermaid, Rocco's Modern Life and the Parent Trap, the one with the, I was going to say the Lo-, the Lohan twins, but realized it's just Lindsay Lohan twice.
Ellie: So the parent trap with Lindsay Lohan twice. We are so excited. If you live in Boston or even if you don't and just want to take a trip, we would love to see you there. Yet again, you can get your tickets at bit.ly/lezbostonlive. We also have a bunch of Lez Hangouts coming up, our Lez Hangouts in Pittsburgh is June 4th, in Seattle is also June 4th and in Boston is June 13th. If you want more details, make sure you join our Facebook page for all of those. And we have a tee public sale this week. Again, so many of you bought t-shirts last week. We are so excited to see all of your pride gear. We have one more sale before pride month starts and it's gonna be May 22nd through 24th, so make sure you get all of your Lez Hangout Pride tees, Pride mugs, so you can rock them all through June and the rest of the year. And in the Greater Lez universe. I'm sure some of you are already watching, but if you have not, you need to start watching. Gentleman Jack. It is amazing, cheeky and period piece, everything that you could ever want in a lesbian series. So if you're not watching Gentleman Jack, you are really missing out. Make sure to start watching it because it's wonderful. And with that back to you Ellie and Leigh. Thanks Ellie and Leigh and welcome to our 27th installment of Should've Been Gay.
Singing: Should've Been Gay Theme
Leigh: And in this week's episode, [singing] No gays beyond our reach--Elastigay!
Ellie: I love it. So much.
Leigh: I wish everyone could have seen my really impressive superhero arm thrust into the air.
Ellie: Yeah, it was really impressive.
Leigh: In defiance of uh society's expectations of me. It was, it was something y'all, it was something,
Ellie: I like to say that ah gayness is elastic instead of fluid.
Ellie and Leigh: Ooh.
Leigh: That was, that was like some deep words for this early in the episode, Ellie.
Ellie: Right? I've been, I've been sitting on that all day, so I'm...
Leigh: You're like, I wrote it down this morning so I didn't forget.
Ellie: Like, no, just, just say it. I'm like, you can't, you don't need to wait.
Leigh: As our more astute listeners may have already figured out, this week, we are gonna be talking about Incredibles Two, not Incredibles One, although that would be a fun challenge, sometime down the line.
Ellie: I feel like there still is some gay in the first Incredibles, we'll talk about it.
Leigh: I'm sure we can find it.
Ellie: But the second one...
Leigh: Incredibles Two, that's, that's really, you know.
Ellie: Oh, they really push it.
Leigh: That's what we're going to dig into a little bit because, hoo. Hoo boy.
Ellie: It just, it really should have been gay and we're gonna, we're gonna get into it.
Leigh: So why don't we start with our IMDB synopsis, which is as follows, the Incredibles hero family takes on a new mission, which involves a change in family roles. Bob Parr, Mr. Incredible, must manage the house while his wife, Helen--Elastigirl, goes out to save the world.
Ellie: Love it. That is a pretty accurate description. I will say, just to start off, like just shifting those gender roles, to start... This whole episode leads well into what we're going to talk about, but my gay synopsis is not really about Mr Incredible or Helen.
Ellie: It's about my favorite character, Evelyn. And this is a superhero movie where the supervillain can't sit and cannot hide her gayness.
Leigh: Amazing. I'm gonna--here's what I think my gay synopsis would be. Buckle up kids. Mom's got a new job, she's wearing the pants now and she's the one having the affair. Take that gender norms.
Ellie: [Laughter] I loved that. Oh, see, that's where we'll talk. That's where I have some moral dilemmas with this film because Mr Incredible and Elastigirl--he's taking care of the family. He's doing all the things. He's a great man. He has some, he has some issues with his masculinity and how fragile it is. I will give it to Bob.
Leigh: Well, what man doesn't?
Ellie: Right? But he's doing his best for his family. So I have a hard time being like, you know what Elastigirl, you go, you cheat on your husband who's doing everything and being a good dude.
Leigh: But you don't have to be conflicted, Ellie. She doesn't, in reality, but you know, we're just gonna dream a little.
Ellie: We're gonna. Yeah, we're going to toy with it a little bit.
Ellie: So Leigh, what was your experience with the Incredibles Two?
Leigh: So let, yeah, let's start with me. Right? My experience is, I still haven't seen Incredibles Two, but like a dutiful podcaster, I have done ample research for all of you. You're welcome.
Leigh: But I haven't actually watched it yet, but now I started doing research and now I'm obsessed with, I need to watch it like now.
Ellie: See, I actually really love these episodes where...
Leigh: [Laughter] Where, one of us hasn't seen it.
Ellie: Yeah, like I feel like maybe we should even make that our format to be like, all right. One of us has to have not seen it, because.
Leigh: But some of the best ones we've definitely seen. I mean...
Ellie: Yes, yes. I love it. My experience with Incredibles Two is that I watched it on a plane, like all great kid's movies. I'd be like, I can't, I cannot justify seeing a children's film in theaters anymore. Even though, like of course I want to, especially with Incredibles Two, because when did the first one come out? Like when I was a child or in high school,
Leigh: Oh my god, so long ago.
Leigh: Yeah. It was like 15 years ago.
Ellie: Yeah. The first Incredibles was like a movie that I watched at a, at a normal age to watch an animated film.
Leigh: Cartoon movie.
Ellie: Right. So I loved The Incredibles, and when I heard that Incredibles Two was coming out, I was super excited about it. But alas, I just saw it on a plane. Sitting on a plane watching a Should've Been Gay is always the best experience.
Leigh: Hahahaha. Okay. I'm going to say what wins though? Sitting on a plane watching a Should've Been Gay or sitting on a plane watching a Lez-ssential? Cause they're both...
Ellie: Oh yeah.
Leigh: They're both A plus experiences.
Ellie: Which one did you watch? Did you watch The Favourite on a plane or something?
Leigh: I watched The Favourite again on Bart. I know one, I mean one of the many times I watched it to take notes for our episode.
Ellie: Yes, you're right. Obviously watching a Lez-ssential's a little bit more obvious, but, so I read this article by Heather Hogan about Incredibles Two.
Leigh: Our fave, Heather Hogan.
Ellie: Yes. And she was talking about how she went to see it in theaters by herself and she wished she had been with another gay, because she just was looking around the theater and she said she like found another gay, cause you do, and like gave her a knowing look and they both were like, this is so gay.
Leigh: [Laughter] Nice!
Ellie: That's what I want to happen. You know when you're on, you're on the plane and you're watching the movie and you're like, is anyone else--is anyone else seeing how gay this is?
Leigh: Yeah. Right?
Ellie: Like is this just me?
Leigh: Also, you know who did watch Carol on a plane, is Heather Hogan and then wrote an amazing, maybe she posted, maybe she wrote an Autostraddle article about watching it on the plane. I think so. You should find it. You should look it up. It's hysterical. But I definitely watched something on a plane and I don't remember.
Ellie: Yes, but either way. So good.
Leigh: Sometimes, you just need to know that other people are seeing what you're seeing.
Leigh: That's why we do this segment.
Ellie: We're always seeing what you're seeing. We promise you and this one is so not even subtexty, so let's just jump in. Which characters should have been gay?
Leigh: Well, let's start with one and work our way through.
Ellie: All right, great. So number one, actually let's start with the smaller ones and work up to the big ones.
Leigh: Ah, wow. You're gonna. You're going to build the anticipation.
Ellie: Yes, because smaller but serious, honorable mention to Void.
Leigh: Oh, absolutely.
Ellie: So number one, not to say like lesbians have to look a certain way, but Void definitely looks like a type of lesbian. One of them. With the like side shave, the colored hair, the alt punk, lesbian, type. I would say.
Leigh: Void's the type of lesbian who could like do your tarot reading.
Ellie: Yes, yes, yes, yes. And the way that she talks to Elastigirl is just like the ultimate, like I've been in love with this woman. Like it's her celebrity crush.
Leigh: This is someone who had Elastigirl, like a wall of Elastigirl photos, in her bedroom. Yes. Who still has a wall of Elastigirl photos in her bedroom.
Ellie: Exactly. And didn't realize until much later why she really loved Elastigirl, but she really loved Elastigirl.
Leigh: Void used to draw little hearts in her notebook and write like Mrs Elastigirl inside of them.
Ellie: Oh my god. So true.
Leigh: All right. Am I going to make you cry already?
Ellie: Yes. I love Void so much and also her speech to Elastigirl is basically like when I saw you I knew that I could be me.
Ellie: Right? And of course I always say that magic is a metaphor for gayness. Also superpowers, metaphor for gayness.
Leigh: One hundred percent, we get the coolest metaphors.
Ellie: We really do.
Leigh: We could take over the world with our metaphors.
Ellie: Yes! Superpowers and magic. So gay, but true. I love it so much. This whole movie, if you take superheroes are illegal in the movie, you have Violet, who is honorable mention number two, always talking about how it's so unfair. Why does she have to hide who she is?
Ellie: Because it's illegal, because other people don't understand. Right.
Leigh: But dammit, they were born this way.
Ellie: Exactly. Baby, they were born this way.
Leigh: Ah, no. Okay. I was saying this to Ellie before we started recording, but have... Given that I hadn't seen the movie and I just had to do my research so then we could record this. All Ellie told me is, oh my God, Incredibles Two is the gayest thing. You have to see it and we have to do an episode on it. And I immediately, 100% assumed the gay was going to be Violet.
Leigh: I refuse to believe Violet's not at least coming out as bisexual in college.
Ellie: Oh yes. For sure. And she does, in Incredibles Two. She has a love story with a boy. It's very sweet. Cute.
Leigh: Sure. Not to discount that at all.
Ellie: I will give that to her. But I agree. When I said in the beginning of the episode, Incredibles One, debatable, it was because of Violet.
Ellie: But that's, you know, I think we need to see Violet progress a bit, but she is totally the awkward anxious gay.
Leigh: For sure.
Ellie: Oh yeah. Love her. And hope she gets to be who she is.
Leigh: We'll wait. We'll wait for Incredibles Three.
Leigh: We've got time
Ellie: Also. This is maybe a stretch, but I don't even care. Dash is so Metro.
Ellie: Like, I could just see him either growing up to be this like preppy full of himself jock, which you know what? Honestly, no matter what, preppy full of himself jock either so gung ho about his sexuality that he's like the coolest gay guy on campus. Right? Or completely straight, bro-dude. We have to see where dash comes, but I would love to see him as this über confident gay in the future.
Leigh: That would be amazing. Also, while we're talking about the potential gay in Incredibles One, I mean there's no way that Syndrome didn't also grow up with a whole wall of Mr Incredible photos.
Ellie: Oh yeah.
Leigh: And had a giant like, little man crush on him. 100%
Ellie: 100% yes.
New Speaker: Yeah. Also, wait, you didn't even have this written down and I am so disappointed in you right now, and so I'm going to publicly shame you on our podcast in front of everyone. How, when we're talking about gay characters in the Incredibles, is Edna Mode not even written down?
Ellie: Oh my God, EDNA!
Leigh: There is no way. Not even a little bit of a chance that Edna Mode is not a lesbian.
Ellie: Oh, she's such a lesbian. Oh my God.
Leigh: Come on.
Ellie: I'm so honestly, I deserve to be shamed for that.
Leigh: You're welcome everyone.
Leigh: I did that for you.
Ellie: Oh my God, I Love Edna so much. Edna, to throw it back to another Should Have Been Gay, Edna is basically Bellatrix Lestrange's character in Ocean's Eight.
Leigh: Yeah. Oh my God. She's a real life Edna Mode
Ellie: I'm like what's that actor's name? But I know it. Helena Bonham Carter.
Leigh: That's amazing.
Ellie: All coming full circle.
Leigh: She's like a tiny, take no shit Lesbian.
Ellie: Yeah, she really is. Oh my God. I love her so much. I just love all the characters. The character work in this film-- impeccable. Which brings us to, now that I think all the minor characters we've...
Leigh: We've had our aperitifs now we're ready.
Ellie: Yes. Now I won't keep you waiting too long to talk about Evelyn.
Leigh: Let's talk about Evelyn. Could we?
Ellie: Yes. Evelyn is like the power lesbian of my dreams. Like, yes, she's a villain. Sorry, spoiler alert, but I don't even care. Can you please read, please read what you read to me.
Leigh: Oh, hold on. I have to find it.
Ellie: Before we started this episode, because it perfectly sums up how I, and I am going to guess, a lot of you in our audience feel about Evelyn and Incredibles Two.
Leigh: Okay, so as can only be expected. Some of my research for this episode led me to Tumblr...
Ellie: Of course.
Leigh: As is so want to happen when researching gay things. So I would like to credit Tumblr user, CarolDaddyDanvers.
Ellie: Oh my God.
Leigh: ...For This excellent take on The Incredibles Two that goes as follows, ahem, "the human part of my brain, "queer coding, Evelyn Deavor and then making her evil is bad". The lesbian part of my brain, "Step on me, Hot Evil Lady. "
Ellie: Honestly, I feel that so much.
Leigh: I love the Internet so much sometimes.
Ellie: I feel that so much. Well that's, that's the same way I feel. I feel like I'm like human brain, "Elastigirl and Evelyn can't have an affair because Morals and everything.
Leigh: ...And Marriage and love.
Ellie: Yeah. Lesbian part of my brain is like "Evelyn and it's like, Evelyn uses mind control to sleep with Elastigirl."
Leigh: And you're like so there for it.
Ellie: I'm like, that's so horrible. But I'm like, "but I want to see it."
Leigh: I just want everyone to know how much Ellie's like blushing right now but still totally committed to it.
Ellie: It's so horrible.
Leigh: She's ashamed but she's not not wanting it still.
Ellie: Yeah, I'm ashamed but I'm not, I'm still saying the words.
Leigh: Also. Can I tell you how all I can think of with the 'Step on me, hot evil lady' is how it's reminding me of the whole thing after the Met Gala with Tessa Thompson and did you see someone on Twitter was like, Tessa Thompson like step on my neck or something and she literally quote tweeted them and was like I would, but gently,
Ellie: Oh, my God.
Leigh: Cause did you see her shoes at the Met Gala? Holy Shit. Anyways, anyways we're getting a little off topic.
Ellie: A little off Topic. All right.
Leigh: Let's start with Evelyn's hair. Can we just start like at the top and the top is her hair?
Ellie: Yes. Literally perfectly cut. I don't know the numbers cause I never get my hair cut that short, but it's like a boy's like three or whatever or whatever the number is and always looks like she rolled out of bed. But did it on purpose, like how messy it is?
Leigh: It's a perfect lesbian haircut.
Ellie: It's perfect. Yes.
Leigh: It really is.
Ellie: It's gorgeous.
Leigh: Yeah. I don't wear my hair even that long anymore, but I kind of want that haircut.
Leigh: You know what I want. I want that haircut. But for like Shane to give it to me.
Leigh: Right? Like don't you imagine?
Ellie: Shane definitely cut Evelyn's hair for Incredibles Two.
Ellie: It's so gay. It's so perfect. We love it.
Leigh: Evelyn just like pops down to LA every now and then to get a haircut.
Ellie: Well she is like a design mastermind, so I'm sure she has plenty of money to go fly to LA and get her hair cut whenever she wants. Yeah. If we keep moving down, actually physically, I actually want to talk about the eyes.
Ellie: So there are...
Leigh: Nothing in the forehead region screamed gay at you. Got it, eyes. Eyes next.
Ellie: Yeah, the forehead, the forehead's a little bi--the eyes...
Ellie: Lesbian. She just, you know, we'd talk, we always talk about like the lesbian smolder.
Ellie: Like she has it, so bad, and she...
Leigh: They also cannot stop making eye contact.
Ellie: She always, yes. And she's always using that lesbian smolder and directing it towards Elastigirl.
Ellie: Like always. Yes. It's all over Twitter where people just post all of these gifs of Evelyn and her freaking eyes. Like just giving lesbian eyes.
Leigh: Well, and you know what too, what I have to say is, here's the thing, when you have actresses, right, I understand there are a lot of ships that are non canon ships where you just feel like the writers are refusing to lean into the obvious chemistry between their actors, but the chemistry is there. Right? And that might just be because sometimes people have chemistry and the chemistry can be reflective of a lot of different things between those two people and how they interact with each other on a set. But this isn't a set, these aren't actors.
Ellie: It's literally they made the animation to be gay.
Ellie: They chose...
Leigh: Right? All I've done is watch clips and I'm watching clips going, who did this? This can't be by accident. It's impossible. You have to have done this on purpose. How do you purposefully do this and not know?
Leigh: You can't not know.
Ellie: Oh yeah.
Leigh: There's just, there's no way.
Ellie: I like to think that whoever was like the lead animator on this, looks like Evelyn. Like I'm literally like was just like throwing like... It was like this is me. Like and just made herself like the most like...
Leigh: She wrote her own fanfiction as the movie.
Ellie: Yeah. She wrote her own story. She was like, if I could be a lesbian super villain, I would be Evelyn.
Leigh: I love it.
Ellie: Yeah, but whoever greenlit all the clips just had no clue. And like Animator-Evelyn's just sitting there like...
Leigh: So, aka a man. Yeah okay.
Ellie: Animator-Evelyn's like "he he he, we got it through."
Leigh: It's amazing sometimes how straight people are just like, "oh, what two good friends"
Ellie: Two good friends bonding over feminism. Feminism is also a metaphor for lesbians.
Ellie: I'm just kidding, straight women, please be feminist and straight men can be feminist. I'm just kidding. But you know what I mean?
Leigh: I do know what you mean. Everything should be gay and that's why we're here.
Ellie: Yes. I really love that you started by talking like from the head down because I feel like this actually is a perfect way to start to like actually go through Evelyn.
Leigh: But I just want to be clear that we are moving our way down this character--not in like a male gazey way, but in like a female gazey way. Okay?
New Speaker: Yes. G-A-Y-Z-E.
Leigh: Get your female gayze tee shirts now.
Ellie: Shameless plug. Just in time for Pride. Okay, so if we keep moving, down. I guess the next thing would be her outfits. You think, is there anything in between? The smirk, the lesbian smirk? I feel like goes with the lesbian gayze.
Leigh: She does kind of have a lesbian smirk.
Ellie: Yeah, but that's neither here nor there. So the outfits, her first fricking outfit, like Leigh you're wearing it right now. Are you wearing... Oh no you're not. I thought it was a button down. I wish.
Leigh: Oh, no, but you know I do own a lot of button downs.
Ellie: You rock like a striped button down shirt. Every time you see her, she's in a button down and like, same thing. I don't want to keep saying like lesbian stereotypes, lesbians wear button downs, but lesbians wear button downs.
Leigh: And we look good in them. And she looks good in them.
Ellie: She looks good.
Leigh: You know why? It's because they go with that expertly quaffed hair.
Ellie: Exactly. They were really just pushing it. Oh my goodness. All right, and then moving even further down. I really love this. She can't sit.
Leigh: She cannot.
Ellie: She cannot sit.
Leigh: She cannot sit.
Ellie: She cannot. There are so many times where she is number one... She sits on a table crosslegged one time. Why are you sitting? She's not even sitting on a chair. She can't sit so much she doesn't even know what you sit on.
Leigh: She's sitting on the floor , she's sitting, she's like sprawled in a chair. Yeah, girl can't sit.
Ellie: She cannot sit. Those are my favorite things on Twitter when they just have pictures of Evelyn in all of her different seating positions. Oh my God. Evelyn is a queer icon. She really is.
Leigh: I kinda really love it too because it's like, no, we're going to finish. I'm going to come back to this. I'm gonna hold onto this we're gonna finish. Finish our way working our way across Evelyn first.
Ellie: Okay. I feel like that's pretty much it, she can't sit. I don't, I don't remember too much about her shoes. They probably were Doc Martens. I couldn't tell you.
Leigh: Okay. The other Evelyn characteristics that I want to toss out there as gay?
Leigh: One when she, okay, so we already spoilered she's the bad guy and again, I haven't seen the movie so all I've seen is like this clip in a fan vid that someone made and she is drugging Elastigirl's something I don't know what's happening?
Ellie: I'll tell you what happens.
Leigh: You tell me, you, Ellie has seen the movie, you tell me.
Ellie: So she is this like genius mastermind inventor and she creates these goggles, basically mind control goggles, that she puts on all of the superheroes.
Leigh: This is way better than my like roofie imagination of the scene.
Leigh: I mean not by much, but you know it's at least more technological.
Ellie: I do think though, now that I'm remembering, I think she does like slip her something so that she passes out and then she puts the, when she wakes up the goggles are on her. So she's yeah...
Leigh: Okay well then, whenever she roofies her, they're in a plane or something. And she, roofies her.
Ellie: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.
Leigh: She pulls her little chin up, in the gayest move ever. Oh my God. That I was just, it was, it was gay. That's very gay.
Ellie: That's honestly it.
Leigh: And I also really love how, apparently the plan of "let's rebrand Elastigirl" is put her on a fucking motorcycle. Gay! Gay, gay gay.
Ellie: Yes. And whose idea was that? Gay Evelyn.
Leigh: Gay Evelyn. They may as well have called her Elasti-Gay. I mean, come on, come on.
Ellie: Come on. So here's my like super inappropriate, horribly problematic retelling of the story.
Ellie: Okay. Is that, and it honestly, it doesn't take much, in the real movie--Evelyn wants to control the superheroes because her father was killed and she blamed superheroes for his death. Okay. And so she wants superheros banned and she's going to control them to make them evil. So Blah, blah, blah, whatever. So my retelling of the story, that whole thing happens. But she falls in love with Elastigirl. And so her plan to control all the superheroes, she still goes through with it. But she decides last minute that in controlling Elastigirl, she wants to keep her as her pet. So problematic. I know. She wants to keep her and use the mind control on her to keep her as her girlfriend. That's my retelling.
Leigh: Okay. But then, plot twist... Is Helen wasn't really under mind control.
Ellie: This whole time. Yes. And she is actually really in love with Evelyn as well.
Leigh: There, I've unproblematiced it a little bit for us.
Ellie: Thank you. Yeah, she takes off the goggles and she's like, wait, but I do still love you. Yeah, it's twisted. But Evelyn's a villain. She is a villain and I want to keep her as a villain because it's, you know, she's pretty bad ass not going to lie.
Leigh: So what I wanted to say before, but I wanted to hold onto is I do kind of love, cause one of the things about the Incredibles movies is they take place in this sort of ambiguous time era.
Leigh: Right where it's like kind of like the 50s...
Ellie: But also like super high tech.
Leigh: Right? It's like it's like futuristic steam, punky 50s.
Leigh: Right. And so I mean I do like, I think there is some validity to, to my gay synopsis of it, which is that I really feel like it is. Right? I get that she didn't actually have an affair, but I think they just sort of flipped the whole thing on its head.
Ellie: Oh yeah.
Leigh: Right, like flipped that stereotypical dichotomy on its head of "husband's going to go out to work every day and be led astray but feminine wiles" and instead, you have Elastigirl who's going to go out, be given a motorcycle and fall for a giant, giant gay.
Leigh: And I'm kind of here for it.
Leigh: I sort of like that.
Ellie: It is honestly true. Even in the movie, not even reading, not even reading too much into it. She falls in love with that life. Like she falls in love with being the provider, being the person who is working, being that person. And she connects with Evelyn in a way of Evelyn works for herself. Evelyn's never had to... Clearly you can tell Evelyn has never had to be at home taking care of the kids with her man. I don't think she's ever had to answer to a man ever in her life because she's a big old lez! And I think Elastigirl envies Evelyn. Like she envies the life that Evelyn has had of making it on her own without a man ever. Even though she loves Bob, no matter what. I think there still is some jealousy of Evelyn's life, like wanting that.
Leigh: Agreed. Can we also go down some lesbian rabbit holes? A little bit.
Ellie: Of course.
Leigh: I see one of them that you have written down.
Ellie: Yes, I needed to.
Leigh: Let's start right now
Ellie: Okay, so Holly Hunter plays Elastigirl and as I was going through Holly Hunter's IMDB, I found that not too long ago she played Billy Jean King, which we all know--lesbian.
Leigh: I mean it was 18 years ago, but who's counting?
Ellie: You know, not too long ago, but still amazing and I'm sure Leigh has plenty of other lesbian rabbit holes for us to go down.
Leigh: I have just one, but it's one I'm very, very proud of. Okay. Because Evelyn is voiced by Catherine Keener, who I cannot believe has never played gay. I was so sure I was going to find something and I didn't. But I did find an excellent lesbian rabbit hole, which is that Catherine Keener has a younger sister and her younger sister is named Elizabeth Keener, who some people might also know as fucking Dawn Denbo from...
Ellie: Are you kidding!?
Leigh: ... Season Five of the The L Word.
Ellie: Oh my God. Honestly, one of the most iconic characters. Oh...
Leigh: "And this is my lover, Cindy."
Ellie: That is so fucking great.
Leigh: So there you go. Our lesbian rabbit hole of today is Dawn Denbo, the little sister to Evelyn Deavor.
Ellie: That is so good.
Leigh: Of course she has Shane cut her hair. It's her sister's nemesis.
Ellie: That is amazing. Um I love also for our listeners, we always put together an outline for these episodes. I took down my notes, write them in the outline. Leigh likes to save some of hers, keeps them to herself and surprise me with them. And I'm so happy that you didn't write that down.
Leigh: I couldn't ruin the real reaction to hearing it live. Come on.
Ellie: Yeah. So Leigh keeps all these secrets just for you. So I just wanted to let you know how much she cares about the authenticity of this podcast.
Leigh: It was too good to hold onto that one. I just, I like to keep something in my pocket, you know, that's all.
Ellie: It's so good.
Leigh: Got something up the sleeves of these button-downs I wear.
Ellie: Oh my God. Just like Evelyn.
Leigh: Ah, yeah. Except mine isn't Roofies okay. I promise.
Ellie: Oh no villains here.
Leigh: So, okay. Should we, should we do our ships Ellie?
Ellie: Let's dig in. Obviously the characters we are shipping are: Helen, also known as Elastigirl, and Evelyn, they do already have a ship name, which should I wait say it until after we try to come up with some ridiculous ones?
Leigh: Oh, I think you can say it. I mean it's the most obvious one, I feel like.
Ellie: It's the most obvious one. So their ship name is "Hevelyn", which I actually love. So I'm going to have a really hard time coming up with new ones, but if I have to be weird... "Elastilyn".
Leigh: I think "Elastilyn" would work. I also, I want to do something with Deavor like Deavlastic... Deavastigirl. It kinda sounds like disaster girls.
Ellie: Oh, I like that though.
Ellie: Deavastigirl! I like Deavastigirl. See Helen and Evelyn are clearly meant to be together because most of their ship names would work.
Leigh: Yeah, I think so.
Leigh: Ela... Elastilyn,
Leigh: What's Helen's last name? Parr.
Ellie: Yeah, but she would probably have to change it if they got back tog... If they got together because...
Leigh: Yeah, we don't know her maiden name.
Leigh: Thanks, The Fifties!
Ellie: Goddammit. And I also would like to say honorable mention to Void and Elastigirl, but Void and the Elastigirl poster on her wall. Poor Void.
Leigh: Ah. She would have been so cute though.
Ellie: I know. Void will get her girl.
Leigh: She'll get someone right? If there's an Incredibles Three, it's going to be Violet coming out and Void getting like a cute supportive girlfriend.
Leigh: Okay. I'm here for it.
Ellie: I love it. I love it. Yeah. I would just like to say, I never thought an animated film could be so gay and I am so here for it.
Leigh: So Incredibles Two...
Ellie: Should have been gay,
Leigh: Should have been gay.
Singing: Hip Hip, We're Gay Theme Song
Leigh: We love hearing from all of you. We love continuing to build this community and we want to take the opportunity to shout out some of our favorite things that have been happening every episode.
Ellie: Okay. So I have a few shout outs this episode and one of the biggest ones is to two of my best friends, Alexa Evans and Amelia Two-rek. They hosted our first ever Lez Hangouts, Denver. It was wonderful. They had a great time and I just can't wait to have some more of them. We also had a bunch of you reach out to us on social media this week. It was a really fun week on our social medias. So I want to shout out a few of you. And the first one is Hannahk98 who sent me the most hilarious meme that said, "When people tell me to stop saying when something should have been gay." And is just Salt Bae sprinkling down little Pride Flags. So that made my day and I just wanted to say thank you Hannah for sending that to me. And I want to shout out another one of our listeners from Australia, who sent us this really wonderful Instagram message that says that she's had a really hard time finding shameless pride in being a lesbian. And you know, we find shameless pride in being lesbians. So I'm really happy that she said that the podcast has validated a lot of her struggles and is really helping her through. So I wanted to say thank you to her and to also let her know that we're here anytime she wants to shamelessly be a lesbian. And I like to just say a quick shout out to everyone who took our poll for The Favourite. If you were team Lady Sarah or team Abigail and I'd just like to Say Lady Sarah, forever 92%. Sorry to the 8% of Abigails love you, but no.
Ellie and Leigh: And as always we have to thank our top tier Lesbian Jesus patrons, Amy and Ellen. Kayla Kelly, Lizette Stai, Tanya Ferguson, Jess Klaus, Dani Griswold, Michelle Raye Thomas, Sarah and Julia, Nicole Grohs, Carrie Anne Lawrence and Mark Foster.
Leigh: Thank you so much to all of you and to all of our patrons who make this podcast possible for us. We could not do it without your support.
Ellie: Remember, you can also find us on all the social medias, Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter at lezhangoutpod.
Leigh: You can email us at firstname.lastname@example.org sending us your "should've been gay" suggestions. We cannot get enough of them.
Ellie: You could check out our website at lezhangoutpod.com
Leigh: And make sure that you subscribe in whatever app you use to listen to podcasts and you'll get new episodes as soon as they air.
Ellie: Make sure you also subscribe to our Youtube Channel at youtube.com/leszhangoutpod. We're releasing videos every other Thursday.
Leigh: If you want to help support the podcast, there are so many different ways that you can do that. First one, it's easy, it's free. Go on iTunes, leave us a rating, leave us a review. It really helps new people find the podcast
Ellie: And if you want to support us financially, you can join us on Patreon at bit.ly/LezPatreon. We love our Patreon members. We have such a good time with, Watch Parties, Our Facebook page, we even have a little discord chat. We've been talking about Captain Marvel, how gay it is. You know the usual, so join us there at bit.ly/LezPatreon.
Leigh: If you do want to pick up a Female Gayze shirt or any of our other designs, you can get them at bit.ly/LezShop. Make sure you check it out. Pride is coming up. We have so many good designs that you could rock at whatever Pride you're going to be going to.
Ellie: Amazing. And we actually have a sale on all of our tee shirts this week, the 22nd through the 24th so make sure you get those to get your tee shirts right before Pride. And if you want to donate to our Trevor project campaign, you can do that at bit.ly/LezTrevor.
Leigh: A final way that you can help support the podcast is come see us live. We have a show coming up at Boston Pride. We are going to be at WBUR City Space. We will have details coming up soon. It is still kind of being worked out, but we are so excited we can't wait to see you all there. If you want to follow us individually, the best place to find me is on Twitter and Instagram at LSHfoster.
Ellie: And you can find me at EllieBrigida on Instagram and Twitter. And with that I'm Ellie...
Leigh: And I'm Leigh.
Ellie and Leigh: And Lez hang out again soon.
Singing: Lez hang out.
Leigh and Ellie dive into But I'm A Cheerleader for this Lez-ssentials episode, a recurring segment on the essential movies and TV shows in the lesbian canon. But I'm A Cheerleader is a 1999 movie about gay conversion camp starring Natasha Lyonne and Clea Duvall. Leigh and Ellie love this movie in all it's CAMP-y glory and have a lot to say about the Pepto Bismol colored outfits, finding their root, Andre living his best gay life and the ridiculous cast including RuPaul and Michelle Williams. Lez-ssentials comes complete with a But I'm A Cheerleader drinking game because every lesbian movie should be accompanied by heavy drinking. This episode also comes with an original Lez-ssentials song based off of the movie. "Mommy Dearest." Follow along on Twitter: Lez Hang Out (@lezhangoutpod) and answer our Q & Gay at the end of every episode. Leigh Holmes Foster (@lshfoster) and Ellie Brigida (@elliebrigida). You can also join us on Facebook.com/lezhangoutpod and Instagram (@lezhangoutpod).
Leigh (@lshfoster) and Ellie (@elliebrigida) talk about why 10 Things I Hate About You should have been gay with some help from Tina Kakadelis, the author of I Didn't Start the Fire and Burn Before Reading. Hear us out. Our lesbian synopsis is a pretty, popular teenager can't go out on a date until her ill-tempered sister stops being such a huge lesbian. Kat Stratford (Julia Stiles) doesn't date men because shocker, she doesn't want to and she wants to date women. She spends her weekends at her favorite lesbian bar listening Bikini Kill with her best friend and lover, Mandela. Patrick Verona (Heath Ledger) is the high school lesbian everyone wants to be and Cameron James (Joseph Gordon-Levitt) is the high school lesbian we all were. 10 Things I Hate About You: The Sequel follows Kat to college at Sarah Lawrence, because she only wants to be surrounded by women, yet again. This one was just way too obvious. Follow along on Twitter @lezhangoutpod and Facebook and Instagram (@lezhangoutpod).